From Burnout and Addiction to Entrepreneurship with Becca Gardner

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Full Transcript:

Note: This is an original transcript–edited for sense, length, and clarity.  If you have any questions or concerns, please email our host, Doria Lavagnino, at doria@sheventurespodcast.com.

Doria Lavagnino: She is a Deloitte strategy consultant turned CEO and founderALT Distilling,ing, Inc., a venture-backed mission-based startup that creates non-alcoholic spirits under the brand NKD LDY. [She talks about] why burnout and her toxic relationship with alcohol were major catalysts behind her life pivots, which I think we all understand; we have all been there. Today, she’s here to talk to us about her journey from New York consultant to Kentucky-based CEO and founder in [a] heavily male-dominated sector. Becca Gardner, welcome to SheVentures!

Becca Gardner: Thank you so much for having me today!

Doria: It is great to have you on. 

Gardner’s First Pivots

Doria: As you know SheVentures is about life pivots, and you’ve had several in your job, in your location, and your life. Let’s start with your decade-long high-profile, high-paying consulting career. What drew you to it, initially? What was the attraction? Then, at the very end, what was it that you decided [was] enough?

Becca: Absolutely, so actually I will say, I studied studio art and anthropology [during my] undergrad. I spent most of my summers working in the nonprofit sector. Through that …, I did grow frustrated by, what I perceived, as a lack of business skills that I could bring into those environments. I think it was partly that that made me want to go into consulting. I thought I could get a great general background. I think it was also the challenge — I have not been one to shy away from an opportunity, even if it doesn’t feel like I have the skill sets to do so. 

I think that’s what made me go after the role. I think that I stayed for a decade because of a couple of things. [For one thing,] I’m an addict. I think that it was a high pace, very challenging environment. I could always find ways to improve. It really fed that part of me. I think I was a little bit addicted to the affirmation and the accolades I would receive. I never thought a decade would go by. I thought I was going to go in for a few years and then go back out to pursue my passions. In retrospect, I’m grateful for the opportunity, because I think it’s definitely helped prepare me for my ventures on the other side. 

Doria: Absolutely, and I’ve never shared this publicly on my podcast, but I also have an addiction issue that I’m in recovery for. I completely understand so much of what you’re saying about New York — like how it sucks you in. I came here in my 20s ready to conquer the world of women’s magazines. There’s this frenetic pace that really isn’t human. When you’re yelling, “I think you can,” “I can keep up,” but then you start either drinking or, in my case, it was pain medication. That would just make me feel like I was on my game. It destroyed my life. I totally feel what you’re saying. And the accolades, as well — that external validation. 

Becca: Absolutely, and I tell people this, but I think I was probably a high-functioning alcoholic for most of my adult life. I never had any severe consequences. I was still always able to keep up with my work and job. I think it allowed me to not confront it, head-on, for quite some time. I’m grateful in retrospect for the circumstances surrounding me [and] having to take a closer look at [them]. I can’t imagine if I’d gone through my life not knowing that it was an option [and to] take a step back and make these big changes in my life. I certainly wouldn’t have started this company. 

Doria: I love that you share that, and I think that people who don’t understand dedication have an idea of what an addict looks like. It’s so misinformed. We both have an illness that we have recovered from; it’s an ongoing journey. I’m grateful that we can both share that and own it. Yes, high functioning is key. No one had any idea what I was up to — how I was doing it. I think people will be shocked when they hear this, but it’s not this story — this is not about me. It’s about you, so let’s continue!

You said that there was a conversion of circumstances that made you say “enough is enough.” Can you tell us what those were?

Becca: Absolutely, so actually I won’t go into details about the events, but I had three separate really difficult things happen in my life — that were unrelated to alcohol, but very clearly showed me that alcohol was where I went to not feel the feelings associated with these experiences. 

I went from being someone who probably drank too often and too much in social environments to someone who was drinking alone, at home, to not feel these feelings. I didn’t want to have to confront [them] head-on. After a few months of that, I became very scared. There was no end in sight [for] that behavior. I realized that if I wanted to continue living my life, I had to remove alcohol from my shelf of coping mechanisms.

I would never wish some of these experiences that got me there upon anyone. I do have to say I’m grateful because it meant that I stopped drinking at 30 — not 50 or 60. I think without those challenging moments, I could have seen myself not making any major changes in my life. 

Doria: Which is how you got to where you are today. 

You had an “aha moment” in 2019. You were in London, correct?

Becca: Yes, I was looking at a new job opportunity, actually. I think part of it is that once I got my addictive behavior under control and was recovering, it freed so much of my mind. It wasn’t that I was stuck in the career that I had been [in.] It was that between the time I spent working and the time I spent, probably, trying to hide the fact that I was [a] high-functioning alcoholic, I didn’t have much time to think about what my next steps would be.

In the year or so after I got sober, it was like my world opened up — my mind opened up. I think part of that was realizing that I was, in fact, not content in the world, the environment that I was [in]. I started exploring new opportunities. I became really excited and empowered by my sobriety. I, also, became frustrated that I felt alienated from a lot of spaces I had, historically, had fun in — concerts and going out with friends. 

I was in London looking at a job opportunity that for a lot of reasons was exciting to me. What was more exciting, was how advanced the non-alcoholic sector was in the U.K. I spent so much time while I was there going to bars, restaurants, and hotel lounges that had non-alcoholic options. I was like “Oh my gosh, it is so much easier to be a non-drinker here.” It was mind-blowing. 

I think the other piece was because it was already so kind of integrated [into] the fabric of the hospitality industry, you didn’t get side glances or weird looks when you would order these non-alcoholic options. For me, I was like, “There is no reason that it shouldn’t be like this everywhere.” That kind of conviction, I suppose you could call it, was what led me to turn down the job offer and figure out how to make these types of products more widely available to people back in the U.S. environment that were normally more dissipated.

Doria: I love that. I’ve had that, as well, where I order a Diet Coke and I’ve had people ask me “Oh, you don’t drink?” No, I don’t, but also, like, why do you care? It’s really awkward. 

I love this idea. I know that, for example, non-alcoholic beers [have been] around for quite a while, but you’re talking about spirits, in particular. How did you get [this idea] from London to Kentucky? Tell us about that journey.

Bringing the (Non-)Spirit to Kentucky

Becca: I think it’s funny because sometimes it’s hard for you to see yourself doing anything besides what you have historically done. I think, initially, I thought I was going to become a consultant to help bars [and] restaurants become more accommodating. When [we] started down that path, I quickly saw that there were just not a lot of great options [of] non-alcoholic beers. I was never a beer drinker. I think I enjoyed the cocktail experience, [being] in the scene. I kind of wrestled with this frustration where I was. I was like, “How can I do this if I don’t have [the] tools?”

I ended up saying, “Okay, screw it. I’m going to try to make these products.” I spent quite a bit of time figuring out what they would actually be. I wanted to make sure that they were the types of products that I could get excited about. I think that meant being authentic, being high quality, and being interchangeable. That was a tough nut to crack. There’s a reason I have been working on and thinking about this for three and a half years. 

We did our first run last March. I kind of stepped out and was like, “Oh, you know, we’ll whip this [right] up.” That was, certainly, not the case. 

Doria: From a practical perspective, how does one start looking at ingredients and manufacturers? I can’t even imagine. 

Becca: Oh my gosh! I think by design, these types of industries [are] very hard to access. Everybody is kind of protective of their own kind of, like, intellectual property. What I realized is that it was going to be a tough nut to crack in New York — for a lot of reasons. One, also, being financially. I realized I wasn’t going to solve this overnight. It was going to be hard to pay my rent. I, also, really wanted to work with the existing distillery industry that is primarily based in Kentucky. That’s where I started by reaching out to different master distillers [and] understanding what distillation meant, and how we might be able to augment it to create non-alcoholic products. I, probably, ended up speaking to 50 different individuals that had different areas of expertise. It really took time. There were some people that understood certain parts of the process and not others. 

[We, essentially] got to this point where we realized that [for] our whiskey product, for example, the starting point [was] actually whiskey. What we do is remove the [alcohol] component, which we sell back to distilleries. Then, we build up the flavor with other natural flavors. It’s more complicated than making alcoholic products.

Doria: Wow, yeah, I can imagine, because they’ve got to taste good.

Becca: I think that alongside supply chain challenges — because this is a new product in a new category — to figure out how to make something at a price point that people are willing to pay when there is a little bit of a higher barrier to entry. Nobody wants to spend $50 on a little bottle of booze without booze. For me, it was really hard to develop a thorough understanding of the science. 

[We had to know] which experts to go to, and I would say that’s where my consulting background was really helpful. The type of consulting I did was, essentially, problem-solving. I was never the expert, but more trying to find the right experts to help me with a potential challenge. 

Doria: Oh, absolutely, so you were perfectly positioned to put all the pieces together.

Becca: It was hard. I’d almost, honestly, say that I think that the part of the business I’m in now — where we have the product, we’re going to market, we’re in distribution in a few different regions — that’s almost more challenging for me, personally than the [problem-solving] itself. This is the part of the business that is a bit outside my area of expertise. I always came in on projects, [solved the] problem, left them with a solution and reason, [and moved on] for the next challenge. 

Doria: Yes, [it’s a] little different this time.

Becca: It is. Now, it’s interesting, I mentioned to you, right before we got started, I’m pregnant. 

Doria: Congratulations!

Becca: Thank you! I think I’m going through this process, right now, with several different people — advisors and consultants — figuring out how to make sure what I have created is something that I could easily bring outside support [in] to run this, not just my wild brain. It very much had to get off the ground. 

Doria: Yeah, right! That really speaks to me, because there’s that time where it’s all in your head, and the idea of bringing other people on — it’s necessary and you want to, but it’s almost kind of daunting, too. There is so much that you have to explain and let go of, essentially. 

Becca: Exactly. I think it’s also humbling because as the business has [to] grow, you go from doing everything at the beginning — probably more than is reasonable — and you stop being quite as effective when you’re spread too thin. It really forces you to take a very close look, like “Okay, these are the things that I’m good at and these are maybe the things that I’m not so great at.”

Doria: Absolutely, right. I’ve found that, too, in some of these circumstances. I’m by no means great at everything, of course. Email marketing, for example — there are people that do that so much better than I do.

Gardner on Entrepreneurship

Becca: I think that is the most challenging part of being an entrepreneur. It’s like you want to be good at everything, and that is just not a realistic thing for anyone. It’s almost more important to be good at knowing what you’re good at.

Doria: I so agree with that. It’s interesting because I’ve interviewed a wide range of women — some of whom feel strongly [about] never [wanting] to relinquish control to others who are more about collaboration over time. I think the latter is more my style, only because with two daughters and a life, the idea of working nonstop makes me not only sad but it would just burn me out. 

Becca: Totally. I think it’s also [that] I’ve realized [that] I think I’m a good leader. I think being a leader is different from being a manager. I think growing into what it looks like to not even just find the people that have the right skillsets but figuring out how to collaborate with them most effectively and engage with them. I never thought I would say this, but sometimes I almost just get fatigued from learning.

Doria: Yeah! It’s exhausting! 

Becca: It seems like every time we have a successful time in the company, it means we’re moving to a new phase where I truly have no idea what I’m doing, again. It’s like, “Here we go, again!”

NKD LDY Products

Doria: How many products do you have? What markets [are they in]? How can consumers find out that? How can they find you?

Becca: We have three products. We have a non-alcoholic gin, tequila, [and] a whiskey alternative. We are in distribution in Kentucky and Tennessee. We are at a lot of different locations in Nashville, now. We are at all of the ABC Fine Wine & Spirits in Florida. We’re at a variety of places across the U.S. You can find [us] on our website. We are excited because this summer we will be expanding a bit more broadly. In the meantime, people can purchase our product on our website, which is drinknkdldy.com. I sent over a discount code for your listeners if they’re interested in using 15 percent off. Code: SHEVENTURES to get 15% off first purchase until April 30th, 2023!

Doria: Fantastic! Yes, we will definitely offer that!

Becca on Venture Capital

Doria: You’re also a part of the 2 percent of women who have successfully raised venture capital. Why do you think you were successful? How much capital have you raised to date?

Becca: I have raised a little over $1.2M to date, and [we’ll] probably be raising more this spring — right as I’m about to pop with this baby, which is a whole other thing. 

I know it’s been done before. I’ve spoken to women who have done this. I think, honestly, when I got pregnant, the whole venture piece was what was the most intimidating. It was, certainly, one of the hardest parts for me. I think the reason I’ve been successful is because I’ve always been incredibly transparent with my investors. I found a couple of folks early on that provided kind, strong mentorship. It was through their networks that I started to meet other individuals that had a similar mentality to investments and operated with a lot of integrity. I think that it’s been what has allowed me to keep the business going this long. We, certainly, have encountered challenges; we’re in a new category, a new industry. 

To have investors that are open and flexible to the twists and turns of possibilities. I have friends who have had investors, and when it got 100 percent out-of-the-gate, they had imagined their financial plan, and then their investors [left them]. They had investors who became incredibly involved and sometimes, even, wanted them to shut down shop. One of my friends said, “I think I have mostly brought in investors that I would be friends with.” Frankly, I think that’s important in the early stage. 

I know that as we go into this next round, there will be more seed money. I think that I have a strong army of angels behind me. As I go, that makes me feel a lot more prepared and supported. It’s tough, though, I think I had a pretty great experience. I raised a lot of capital locally here in Kentucky. It still was the thing that, sometimes when I was alone at night or in my office, had me crying.

Doria: Yeah, it’s a lot of rejection, typically.

Becca: Oh my gosh. It’s a lot of rejection. I talked to people who have experienced, as much if not more, no’s than I did. It still feels so personal. You’re basically saying, “Do you believe in me? Do you believe in this idea?” Those no’s sometimes cut deep. One thing that I’ll say is not all feedback means that you have to incorporate it into your plan. 

Doria: Yes, oh my gosh, I was going to say that next! I have been in that situation myself, where each time you pitch a different [thing, the] venture capitalist is going to have a different take on what you should be doing. That is stressful.

Becca: It’s so stressful. I ended up having this patchwork quilt or scarecrow of a plan. You’re trying to bring in everyone’s input and thinking that maybe that would get them across the finish line. That usually isn’t the case. I think that it can dilute your vision.

Now, I always say that I love this company. I’m always even more excited for my next company because I’ll be able to apply all this stuff from the start. 

Creating a Board

Doria: You created a board, as well. Why was that important? Do you have any tips for listeners who might be thinking of doing the same? Why did you do it? What should they look for?

Becca: I don’t want to say I knew I had no idea what I was doing, but I was not one of those entrepreneurs that started off thinking that I had all the answers. 

I think one of the things, before I even got started, was finding a really strong mentor. I found this gentleman who is a very successful venture capitalist. I wanted to find someone who had an understanding of how businesses grow from just a concept through a Series B and even going public. Someone that has been on that journey with a lot of companies. 

I joke that I stalked this person into [the] situation. I met him and I was like, “I want him to be my mentor.” I wanted him to be my board chair — and he will be. He has been extremely helpful in my building out the architecture of what our board looks like. 

I have somebody who could represent product development. I have somebody who has more experience on the sales front. I, specifically, brought on a person because she’s a little bit outside of the business realm; she’s an investor who is an artist, but extremely creative. I think what’s important is bringing in people that have access to much larger networks beyond themselves to help the business grow but also report in a lot of different areas of expertise. I think, also, making sure that they believe in you and have your back. These [people] are going to be the people that when you have your biggest problems, you’re going to first. 

Doria: Is it that you have a certain number of hours? Is [it] like a formal arrangement? How does it work?

Becca: I would say our board is pretty informal, right now. We meet quarterly for several hours; every quarter is a [different] group. I prepare for that meeting with all of our recent financials, accomplishments, and what’s coming down the pipeline. Then, I, typically, check in with each of them individually, I would say once every few weeks. 

In addition to that, I think when I was first fundraising, I was going through that process. I was providing an investor update monthly. I wanted everybody to [know], completely, what was going on, how much money, any victories that could get people over that hurdle. I’ve since shifted, after we closed our first seed, to do quarterly updates. I share [them] with all my investors, as well as prospective investors. I include pitches that we might be going to for our Series A – just to let them know that we’re still here and hope they don’t forget about us. 

I think that consistency and predictability in communication are incredibly important. There are a lot of little folks that want to grow into big things. [You] want to make sure that you’re staying on folks’ radar. 

Doria: It shows that you’re organized, too. It’s so hard when you’re in the middle of building a company to find time to sit down and do that.

Becca: I was just telling my fiancé yesterday — I was like, “I don’t know if I’m actually an organized person.” It’s a funny thing to be, maybe, recognizing [that] for the first time in my mid-30s. 

I think that the challenge [of] starting a business is that all of the organization and structure has to be defined first and foremost. When I was working at Deloitte, I was incredibly organized, because there were all these systems and compliances, and [they were] very clearly articulated about what they looked like. Here, you keep learning more things; you have to do more things that need to be in pace to be able to maintain a level of organization and structure as you’re venturing into the unknown. I find it to be incredibly challenging. It’s just something I’m constantly having to work on improving, personally.

Doria: I wonder if, maybe, that means, eventually, you’ll have a crew that you can just trust with all of the kind of more operational humdrum stuff.

Becca: I’m in the process. I’m bringing on a chief of staff-type role, right now. I’ve been working with this individual. It’s a vulnerable process. I’m having to pull up the hood and say, “Okay, this is what things look like.” I think I’m much more of a creative strategist type of CEO. I think that means that I can maintain a business up until a certain point, but I’m not a CEO personality.

Doria: I understand exactly what you’re saying. 

Becca: I don’t think I could ever be [that].

Doria: Yeah, it’s not what moves you. 

The Biggest Surprise So Far

Doria: What has been your biggest surprise to date in learning how to become a CEO?

Becca: Oh, I think my biggest surprise to date is probably more about how difficult it can be to find the right people to work with. In a corporate structured environment, I would run teams of 20 or 30 people, but all these people have been through a thorough screening and an interview process. I always thought of myself as an incredible manager and identifier of talent. I think without those things in place, I would have made multiple hiring choices that didn’t end up working out. I think that was very challenging for me, even on an emotional level of realizing that maybe I’m not the best at identifying the right people to bring into the fold. 

I think that what I realized is that if you’re building something from a visual concept into reality, it just requires anyone going [in] to have to develop a completely new skillset. It’s nothing you can prepare for. I did think that more of my job before would have prepared me for things like staffing, hiring, [etc.] It’s new [to me]. 

I think we’re still growing, we’re doing better every month. It’s been the most humbling experience of my life. I was a consistent top performer in my job before. There are days [now] where I’m like “Oh my gosh, how am I holding the ship together?”

Doria: I do understand, completely, and I really identify with what [you’re saying]. I was at Condé Nast for 10 years. I didn’t manage a team of 20, but I did manage a group of individuals who had certain skill sets that just were developed because HR had asked the right questions.

I have done that, too. I’ve had to learn how to be a little bit more — I don’t want to say discerning — but like where your business is concerned and when you’re hiring someone, you do have to ask certain questions and there’s nothing wrong with that. That was hard for me. 

Becca: The other thing I’ll say is that it is a little bit more existential. I think I spent so much time incubating this idea and trying to get to a point where I had [a] product that I assumed out-of-the-gate everybody would just think “This was the coolest thing ever.” I talked to a lot of CPG [consumer packaged goods] renewers that have a similar experience. I have to tell you: [It’s] hard to sell stuff. I think that people should be prepared to have to spend just as much time, energy, and grit. Then, actually, after that, maybe, you have a beautiful brand-new product, but getting it out there is hard for a different set of reasons. I think you shouldn’t be discouraged if it’s not an overnight success. 

Most and Least Favorite Parts of Her Job

Doria: I love that! What would you say is your most favorite and your least favorite part of what you do today?

Becca: I think my most favorite part is the interactions with our customers. I think people have that moment where they realize they could still participate in the experiences. That was my main drive for creating this from the start. 

I think my least favorite part is probably all of the administrative stuff. It’s making sure that we’re up-to-date on all of our tax filings and that our systems are set up. It’s all the reasons I didn’t do this, right, but the necessary evils to maintain a business. I think that’s just part of it. I would never be responsible for so much if we hadn’t gotten to this point. I have to also be grateful that I get to complain about those things. 

Doria: What you’re saying is it’s kind of a privileged kind of complaining?

Becca: Yeah, exactly!

Gardner’s Tips

Doria: What tips do you have for women who are considering a pivot in their lives, whether personal or professional?

Becca: I hate to say “I got lucky with the timing of the pandemic,” but I think that other people have said that, actually. 

Doria: It feels weird.

Becca: I’m, obviously, not grateful the pandemic happened. But I think that the circumstances surrounding the pandemic gave me a much more generous financial runway than I would have had otherwise. I think that this has taken longer and has been much more expensive than I ever imagined when I first got started. I think that I would always say, “Go for it,” but I’ve also had multiple friends that have gone for it and not necessarily thought far enough out: about how to make sure that they can continue to work on this passion without the stress and anxiety of their financial point. I would say having that level of preparedness creates an environment where you can be creative and not have to rely on every single milestone being hit at the perfect moment. I think that’s really important. 

I think the other thing — and this is maybe something that you can’t know until you’re there, but I think — [is] that you almost have to be going into something with a flexible mindset, in terms of changes that you’re willing to make, personally. I can tell you that I do not go out to eat as much. I do not spend as much money, even at this point. A lot of the things that I normally would have, but my business also fuels me. I would not rather do anything else. I think if you’re going into it with the mindset that it’s going to be working on what you love and have all the perks from the get-go of what you were doing before, you’re going to be very disappointed. 

If you don’t have that money and savings, I think one thing that I was grateful I did [was] I knew of a couple of freelance opportunities that I could tap into if push came to shove, frankly. I think that kind of level of preparedness of planning to make sure that you have set yourself up with a safe and secure environment is incredibly important. 

Looking Ahead

Doria: I love that! For 2023, what do you have in store?

Becca: Oh man! Well, first of all [deliver] a baby!

I think this is really our year. I think 2022 was a lot of learning and a lot of testing. This January is the first month that we’ve had broader distribution outside of Kentucky. We’re planning to add a few additional markets to that in July. I think it’s going to be exciting to go from this incubated kind of local brand to a more national brand. I’m excited to be able to support more people in making whatever choice is right for them. 

Doria: Thank you so much for coming on SheVentures and speaking so authentically!

Becca: Of course, thank you so much for having me! This has been fun!

Doria: Absolutely, it has been!

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