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Full Transcript:

Note: This is an original transcript–edited for sense, length, and clarity.  If you have any questions or concerns, please email our host, Doria Lavagnino, at doria@sheventurespodcast.com.

Intro:

Doria Lavagnino: The planning company TimeWise Financial took [off] two decades ago. Her pivot is one of increased “entrepreneurial clarity and purpose.” As she describes it, “I have become more intentional about who I choose to work with, leaning toward high-producing moms and women who feel judged by their success.” Here to speak about how she built her practice and honed in on her ideal client, is certified financial planner, Deanna LaRue. Deanna, welcome to SheVentures!

Deanna LaRue: Thank you so much for having me!

Deanna’s Professional Plan

Doria: It’s really exciting for me, too. I always research my guests before speaking with them. It was refreshing to see a woman who stayed in the career that she studied in college and built on that. It’s very unusual.

Deanna: Yes, I agree.

Doria: Was that luck, or did you have such clarity about your professional path?

Deanna: I don’t think I necessarily had the clarity or the luck. I started as a financial advisor’s assistant when I got out of college and graduated with my finance degree. I could have done so much with that degree. I guess it was a bit of luck getting that first job. As her assistant, I could very quickly see [that] I want[ed] to be that person. I wanted to be an advisor. This was definitely for me and just continued with it since then. 

Doria: So, it was a mentorship experience, of seeing another woman running her own business that gave you the courage and the willingness to try it on your own?

Deanna: Yeah, absolutely. I didn’t, at first, try it on my own. [When I was 24,] I went and got a job at a big wirehouse as a financial advisor and got all of my licenses to be able to trade. That quickly showed me that I, also, didn’t want to work for anybody else. 

Doria: What is it like working for a wirehouse?

Deanna: Well, working for the wirehouse was much different. They had, for instance, mandatory Saturdays. I knew that one day I was going to want to have a family, and that wasn’t going to be what I wanted to do. They had cold-calling for a list of their prospects that had already been called 20 to 30 times. That’s who they were wanting me to reach out to. 

Doria: Fun.

Deanna: Yeah! They had their way of doing things there. Sometimes they had their own proprietary investment vehicles. I wanted more for the clients that I was going to be bringing on board. I wanted to do it my way. 

Explaining Some Vocab

Doria: I wasn’t planning on asking this question, but I think it’s important for listeners to understand the difference between a broker-dealer and a CFP, and that you have what’s called a fiduciary responsibility toward your client. Can you explain that?

Deanna: Yes, being a certified financial planner (CFP) means that I have more people looking over me to make sure that I’m doing what is in the best interest of my clients. Having that makes sure that I’m not just placing trades and I’m not looking at this one account for my clients — I’m looking at the whole, entire picture. 

Doria: Maybe it’s changed now, [but I think we all know], but [it was] certainly [the case] five or 10 years ago, large companies push certain things to sell. I hope people wouldn’t do things that aren’t in their client’s best interest, but [if you’re working at such a company] the broker would have that pressure that you don’t have. 

Deanna: Yeah, so being independent means that I can go and choose from the whole world of investments; selecting what is in the best interest of my client, and not what is going to make me more money or in the best interest of my broker-dealer or wirehouse.

Doria: That makes sense.

The Risk-Taker Starts a Business

Doria: Tell me about starting your own business. What was that like? I assume it was after the wirehouse [that] you got your licenses. How did that go?

Deanna: I did. Yeah, it was very scary. I’m a risk-taker, so I trusted myself in taking this venture. My husband, at the time, was like “What are you doing? You’re going to do what by yourself?”

Starting it on my own meant reinventing the wheel. I didn’t just get a manual: “Oh, here are the procedures. Here’s how to talk to your clients. You should invest in [Class] B or C shares.” I had to go and reinvent the wheel, which I’m so grateful for. It forced me to learn every single facet of my business to be able to better serve my clients. It was tough [at the] beginning. I think the biggest hurdle was [that] you’re selling yourself, getting out there in front of clients, and getting people to trust you with their life savings. I was a 24-year-old girl. When I’d have a prospect come into my office, they’d look over the desk at me and say, “Where did you go to college? What’s your experience?” That was definitely challenging in the beginning — having to show my worth a lot more than I’m sure someone that had gray hairs and a little bit more experience under their belt [would have to].

Doria: I can imagine that was very challenging. People today talk a lot about impostor syndrome. It almost sounds a bit like that [was how] you felt — like you had to keep proving yourself to your customers.

Deanna: I did. I, even, would wear my hair up in a bun. Now, at 42, I actually do need glasses, but, at the time, I didn’t. I put blue[light] blockers on [to make] myself look older. I would wear suits to every meeting. All of that has drastically changed. I am who I am now, but at that point in time I did have to wear hardware to prove my worth.

Doria: How does it start? Do you start by [advertising to] family and friends, and then it’s more of a referral over time? How did that work?

Deanna: At first, I avoided family and friends. My mentor at the time had taught me that they would probably be my toughest clients [to bring] on board. Their expectations would be different. 

How it started was I was very committed to each year running a different kind of marketing campaign. One year, I literally went to all of the coffee shops and libraries. I would post [about] and host these monthly educational seminars. I’d get maybe five or 10 people coming to these. Out of those, maybe one — if that — would convert.

One year, I focused on direct mail and started sending information to new homeowners coming into the area. I didn’t want to try something and give it up. I wanted to commit [to it] for the year. 

Now, when I teach and mentor advisors in my field, I tell them that there is no one golden ticket. There is no rainmaker that’s going to make all of the clients come in. It’s about paying your dues and being committed to your process, believing in yourself, and trying. 

All of those efforts over the years have grown my business to be very successful. 

Doria: I was thinking about when you mentioned doing the conferences where you might have had five or 10 people, I thought about today’s terms with digital marketing. If you had one person convert,  it’s a 10 percent conversion rate, which is actually quite high. [Though,] the time that you had to dedicate to that was considerable. It’s interesting. Did one or the other end up [working or was it] a combination? Is there one that works particularly well for you today?

Deanna: Now, it’s based on referrals. I’ve had my practice for 18 years. A lot [is now] based on referrals. At the time, the one that worked the best was hosting what I called roundtables for corporations. 

For instance, Coca-Cola. I’m located in Atlanta, and so in [the] corporate [office] for Coca-Cola. I would learn all of their benefits packages. I’d be able to explain if someone had gotten laid off, unfortunately, had been there 20 to 30 years, and had all these different buckets of money. [They’d say,] “I’ve got my pension. I’ve got my 401(k), I’ve got an IRA CD (Individual Retirement Account Certificate of Deposit). I think I’m going to be okay but where am I supposed to take [the money] from?” I’d be able to go into those groups [of people] and explain their benefits to them — show them that they will be okay.  Those referrals were the biggest at that point in time.

Doria: That’s incredible and such a great idea. I love financial education. I feel it is lacking in our society today. I know that a lot of high schools are trying to have a mandated personal finance course. It’s almost as if we’re expected to know what to do. 

My mom was a CPA. My dad was an entrepreneur. I just happened to be in a family where money was talked about. If you’re not, it can be a very taboo topic. 

Deanna on (Some) Female Clients

Doria: Women are your primary clients, as I [understand] it. [You’ve done] almost two decades of working with women and their financial planning. Are there common issues or roadblocks that you’ve observed with your female clients, specifically?

Deanna: Yeah, with the female clients, especially the highly driven working moms, there are a lot of roadblocks and hurdles, I think. If they’re self-employed — they may have done a brilliant fashion line or business, or whatever they have. They are often expected to know all about taxes and what a mutual fund is. I see them. They feel very intimidated by that. They feel less than others if they don’t understand that. They often hide a lot of those feelings. 

My business is very well-rounded. I have women, couples, [and] kids. Over the past five years, I’ve been [trying to be] more intentional about who I want to work with. I’ve decided that I wanted to work with more people like myself that I resonate with. Being a mom, a wife, Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, a business owner, and a leader of the team — it comes with judgment. It does. As you get more successful, [it comes with] a lot of different expectations. Working with women has really been feeding my soul. 

Doria: That’s what it’s all about at the end of the day — feeding your soul. I don’t think [it] can get better than that. 

Women, Financially, Throughout Their Decades

Doria: For women in each decade of their lives — starting from teenagers, 20s, 30s, 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s, etc., — what is one piece of advice that you would give while they’re planning for each of those decades?

Deanna: As a teen, it would be to step out of your comfort zone and take a risk. I bought my first house when I was 19 years old. In my group of friends, that was unheard of. That allowed me, though, to get roommates to help me pay the bills while I was going through college. After I graduated, then, I could sell that as an asset — which has led to equity [that has] built up to my current dream home. 

I would advise a young adult to start your assets with your first house and start building that equity. 

Doria: Equity is so key. What would you say to a 20-something? I’m thinking, also, of a lot of people who seem to be really affected by student loan debt. [That] might be weighing on their mind. It might be, “Okay, equity versus paying off my [loans]. Which one do I do?” I’m sure it varies by situation.

Deanna: Yes, definitely, everybody’s situation is different in the world of finance. My advice for the 20-something would be that if they do have that student loan — I always like to come up with debt and savings goals for my younger clients. I like to be working on two at a time. If they’re employed and their employer is saying, “If you save 4 percent of your paycheck, then I’m going to match your 4 percent.” That’s a 100 percent return, right away! I always advise them, at a minimum, [to] put in that 4 percent and get that free money. The younger that you can start saving, the more we all that it compounds and the more time it has to grow. 

Doria: Yes, absolutely. To your point, if you start saving when you’re 25, that compounding — assuming that you’re invested in equities — tends to have a rate of return, I think, historically, of 7 or 8 percent, right?

Deanna: Correct!

Doria: It ends up really adding up, even five years makes a tremendous difference.

Deanna: It’s huge. I’ve seen all walks of life. I’ve seen clients come in and they just started saving at age 50. They’re kicking themselves in the behind [and saying] “Gosh, I wish someone would have taught me.” To your point, we weren’t taught this. I was blessed because I chose finance as my degree and education. You’re right, we aren’t taught this. If our parents didn’t teach and our schools didn’t teach us as kids, how are we expected to know that?

Doria: Exactly. I think we’re [up to] 30-somethings now. This is typically the time where — again everyone’s life varies — people might be more settled in their careers. They might be looking at having a family or not, where they want to live, and those kinds of things. What would you recommend there?

Deanna: What I typically see with my 30-somethings is that [this] is the average time that they are starting a family formation. Many people say, “I don’t need a financial advisor because I don’t have money to invest.” Well, that’s not the only reason to go and get a financial advisor. When you’re in your 30s, you’re starting that family formation. That is the perfect time to get a relationship with a financial advisor. You can be more intentional with your future plans and how they’re laid out. 

There are things that need to come along with family formation, like getting a will. If you have kids [and] if something were to happen to you both, — God forbid — who is going to take care of your kids? There are a lot of things outside of the actual investing of the money that needs to be addressed and planned for. 

Doria: Would you also recommend 529 plans at that point, if people are able to?

Deanna: Yes! As soon as I got Social Security cards for both of my children, we opened 529 plans. That is my favorite vehicle for college planning. We’d all like to think that our babies are going to be perfect angels as they get older, but sometimes they may choose a different path. The 529 plan keeps us in control of that. If they did happen to choose that different path, having that big lump sum of money at their fingertips could be a detriment in that situation.

Doria: Yes, I think that’s such a great point. So many people don’t realize what the 529 is and that it’s there for the benefit of their child. If for some reason you decide it’s not the right time or it never will be the right time [for you], you do have control of the money. There’s really no reason [ not to] if you can afford to put that money away. 

Deanna: Absolutely, and I always recommend putting $25 a month into that plan.

With my kids, I show them their statements. I show them my take on making sure that — as their mom and being a certified financial planner, that’s my legacy I’m leaving with them, that they will understand finance — they get to have fun looking at their money and how it’s invested. “Oh, it’s been down last year — but look it’s come up this quarter.” It’s fun for them to look at.

Doria: Oh, that’s great. Okay, the 40-somethings. What do you typically see there for women?

Deanna: Okay, the 40s. This is me, now. The biggest thing I, myself, went through. I think women are more nurturing. We naturally are caring for the kids. It’s not always like this, but we’re the ones often planning birthday parties and changing out seasonal clothes. “Oh my, she’s already grown out of those shoes!”

Doria: Doctor’s appointments?

Deanna: And doctor’s appointments! Then, we’re also trying to be good wives. If you’re a daughter, or a friend you tend to, at this season, get a bit lost. 

I think that when we’re growing up at 18, there’s a goal. “I’m going to graduate high school and then go to college and get a job and find my life partner and have kids.” There’s a list of these goals that our society already kind of lays out for us. What happens when you’ve checked all of those boxes? You’ve lost yourself a bit because you’ve been planning for everything else in your life except for yourself. 

In the 40s, my biggest piece of advice would be to take a lot of time to reflect on who you are, who you’ve become, and what this next season of life looks like for you. Then, from there, what I do with my clients [is] we create vision boards.

Doria: Yes, I wanted to get to that. That’s so cool!

Deanna: Yeah! Then, we go “How does the money match those visions?” If we don’t have those pictures in our heads, it’s very daunting. It’s a very lonely feeling. 

Doria: Yes. Is this one you typically see? Do most women pivot jobs in their 40s?

Deanna: I wouldn’t say that I see them mostly pivoting in their 40s.

Doria: Okay, just curious. So in one’s 50s. We’re getting a little closer to retirement age. 

Deanna: Yes, so the 50s! What I often see is that they’ve been doing what they were told to do. “I’ve been maxing out my 401(k). I’ve stuck with this career. I’ve been here for 20 or 30 years.” They’re recognizing that retirement is closer than they think. That could be a forced retirement if they’ve gotten laid off. Maybe as we get older, health issues start to rise. 

My biggest piece of advice there would be to work with someone and lay out your financial picture, understand the purpose behind every single dollar that you have saved, and how it’s going to work. I tell my clients all the time that my job is to help them make educated decisions for yourself. I want to give you a 30,000-foot view of education so you can be able to make those decisions for yourself. Know that you’re going to feel better having that peace of mind and a plan laid out. 

Oftentimes, I see clients in that age, [and] it’s a reality check. “Oh my gosh, I can’t retire in five years. Health insurance is now like a mortgage payment!” You need to be clear on what that looks like. 

Doria: You would go through that with your clients and really look at the real numbers. Not kind of what we think it’s going to be, 

Deanna: That is exactly it. That’s really when you start pulling in the real numbers. We’re logging into their Social Security account to see what that’s going to look like. I’m having them log into their pension estimator, which they’ve never done before. How much is that pension going to pay out? We’re logging in and looking at all of their investments. “Wow, did you know that you’re still invested as if you were 20 years old?!” 

If we went through [something similar to the] 2008 recession — the biggest recession since the Great Depression — you would lose 40 percent of this money. Can you still handle that, at this season of life? Looking at the real numbers. 

Doria: I don’t mean to lump 60 and everyone else together, but just for the sake of time, what do you typically look at for that point of life?

Deanna: This is really when I like to have my couples come back together on what the vision of their future looks like. Let’s say you have a married couple, and they’ve been married for 40 years. When was the last time that they sat down and talked about what retirement looks like to them? I’ve had one of the spouses say, “I want to retire in the mountains” or “I’m definitely going hunting and fishing.” Then [the other] is saying, “I hate the mountains. I want to retire at the beach.” That is a huge disconnect. Oftentimes, I become a therapist in that situation. 

For the 60s and above, I think the number one thing is that you’re never too old to still have dreams. I often see that they’ve become scared that life is over. Gosh, when I retire, I don’t want to just sit in my recliner watching daytime TV all day. I want more for them. I see them not wanting to retire. “What am I going to do with my days?” Make sure that you have a clear vision of what your ideal day is going to look like. Statistics show that if you don’t have some kind of routine set up within 60 days of retiring, the chances of you retiring in that recliner or watching daytime TV every day is pretty high versus thinking, “Okay, this has been the time I’ve always wanted to learn how to garden” or “I’ve always wanted to get up in the morning and go ride a bike.” Come up with those visions. Then, on your ideal day, when are you making time for those passions?

Doria: What I’m hearing from you is so much about relational instead of transactional. I think [that] is so key to working with anyone with your money. You have to have that kind of relationship and report to them.

Humanizing a Hush-Hush Topic

Deanna: Absolutely, and that is the key to how I wanted to make my business different. I call it humanizing my industry. I wanted to humanize it. I wanted to take such an intimidating topic that to most people is such a hush-hush topic. 

The biggest question that I hear is, “Is this average for my age? Is this the amount of money that you’re seeing other people have?” They want to feel like they’re normal. Being able to humanize this and let them know that they are not alone. Just because you don’t have that will in place or you don’t know what a mutual fund is, you shouldn’t feel bad about that. You are not alone. 

Doria: Absolutely, and investing is not — I mean, obviously there are complex instruments, but like basic equities — terribly complicated to learn with a financial advisor.

Deanna: Absolutely, and you can make it as complicated as you want.

Doria: True!

Deanna: You can go and search on Google and come up with 5,000 different definitions of investment vehicles. You just really need to understand the ones that are best suited for you. They’re not going to be the same ones best suited for your sister, neighbor, or friend.

Doria: That makes so much sense. Over this past year, I know I’ve looked at my own portfolio. I think it’s lost probably 15 or 20 percent. It’s a paper loss, sure, but it still kind of makes me uncomfortable. I’m sure that you have some clients that come to you in fear. How do you handle that?

Deanna: By focusing the conversation back on their goals. If you had come to me after this past year, — where there was nowhere to hide in the markets, everything was down, — I would bring you back to reality. I’d say, “Okay, do you need all of this money next year?” You’re going to say, “No, this is the money that I’m going to be living off for the next three years.” Then, okay, we have a bucket of money that is set up for your first five years’ worth of income. This bucket of money has downside protection on it. We’re not really concerned; we’ve got that covered. We’re not having to take money out of our “income now” bucket and a down market.

Then, we have other buckets of money that are more growth-oriented. To have that reward, you do have to take a bit of a risk. We don’t want to do that with the immediate money that we need. 

I would bring my clients back to their goals and show them their buckets — remind them that they are okay. That’s all they need, is to be talked off the ledge, and feel heard and understood. [They need to know] that they are important and you are explaining and answering all of the questions that they have.

Why Mindset Is Key

Doria: That makes so much sense. Mindset is the last thing I wanted to ask you about before we tell listeners where they can learn more about working with you. Mindset is such a key. It plays a role in how people relate to money. Are there common self-sabotaging behaviors that you help your clients overcome? If so, what are they?

Deanna: Yes, common self-sabotaging behaviors would be. I think there is so much negativity in the world, unfortunately. We’ve got the media. We’ve got our devices. When something happens in China, we know instantly. We’ve got social media that could cause a divide. When we wake up and fill our minds with all of this negativity, then comes fear. We get that fear in our heads: “Oh my gosh, I’m going to lose all of my money! What if I lose my house? What if, what if, what if?” Instead, we should be focusing on the positive. Let’s reflect on how far we’ve come. If you just retired, you were able to save this huge nest for yourself and pay off your mortgage — let’s focus on that!

There’s always going to be something going on everywhere in the world. There’s always going to be an election or war that’s causing market volatility. Sometimes we just need to turn that off. I’m not saying [that’s done] by sticking our heads in the sand — but by focusing on the positives, reflecting more on our accomplishments, and being proud of ourselves.

Doria: You made me think back to my father. He would invest in the ’80s. That was a time when you wouldn’t know until the next day what the stock price did. You’re so right, that now the world is moving at such a fast pace all the time. You’re being inundated with information. It can really lead to a lot of overwhelming paralyzes.

Deanna: Yeah, I tell my clients all the time I wish they only looked at their statement one time per year. That would save a lot of heart attacks that they’re feeling throughout the year. 

If you think about 2020 when we had a global pandemic — when you were looking at your accounts in March and April — people were feeling helpless. “I’m going to lose everything!” Fast forward, if they would have not looked at any of that, by the end of the year, their accounts and portfolios were up. That’s not to say that there wasn’t anything to worry about during [that time] but as far as their accounts, they would have saved a lot of heartache.

Doria: Of course.

Deanna: I have some clients who will go in and look at their investments daily. Some say “No, I don’t want to see. I’m going to do what you said. I’m just going to trust that this is the path and the investment course that I’m supposed to be on.”

Deanna’s Advice to Her Younger Self

Doria: I always like to ask the women that I have on my show what is one tip that you would have given your younger self? It can be professional and personal. 

Deanna: One tip? Oh, that’s a big question! My tip would be to just be yourself from the beginning. It feels so much better. I hate that I had to wait to get into my 40s to have the confidence that I have now. The confidence in my body, my brain, the confidence in being a mom. Now, I don’t wear suits to work. If I feel like wearing bright red lipstick, then I’m going to wear it. I’m 5'10'' and I used to not wear heels because I didn’t want to be taller than my male clients. If I want to now, I’m going to wear heels! I wish, as my younger self, I wasn’t hiding behind those suits, putting my hair up in a bun, and throwing those glasses on. I wish I would have just been more authentic.

Where to Find Deanna

Doria: Yes! And thank you for being so authentic today! I really appreciate it. Where can listeners find out more about you?

Deanna: On our website would be the best place: timewisefinancialllc.com. I have a lot of videos on there. We have a blog page that my team and I post monthly educational videos [on]. That could be very helpful for listeners to go in and take a look at.

Doria: I agree. I did look at a few before our interview! They are very interesting and informational. I highly recommend them. Thank you!

Deanna: Thank you so much for having me!

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