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Full Transcript:

Note: This is an original transcript–edited for sense, length, and clarity.  If you have any questions or concerns, please email our host, Doria Lavagnino, at doria@sheventurespodcast.com.

Intro: 

Doria Lavagnino: She spent nearly a decade in pharmaceutical sales before starting her pivot from leaving Big Pharma to owning a farm. She bought a farm in 2013, and in 2018, she started what is now a cannabis franchise. It all started with her first store, Franny’s Farmacy, in Asheville, North Carolina. Here to speak about her career, life pivots, and how she found her way in an unpredictable but smoking-hot cannabis industry, is Franny Tacy! Welcome to SheVentures!

Franny Tacy: Thanks for having me! It’s such a pleasure to be here and talk with you.

Her Background

Doria: It is always exciting to talk about this industry because it is evolving so fast. I loved your background. You graduated with a degree in forestry and went on to get a master’s degree, also. Then, you decided to pursue pharmaceutical sales. What attracted you to Big Pharma early in your career?

Franny: Quite honestly, I graduated from forestry school, and I had a $40,000 student loan. I was out in the woods having a good old time, fighting fire. I was [in] the first female crew in Idaho in the early ’90s. [I] was just having a ball.

Doria: Oh, cool!

Franny: I couldn’t make college loans. It eventually led to my master’s degree in education. I [also] struggled in that industry to sustain [a] middle-class lifestyle. [Pharmaceuticals] sounded great to me at that time. They were hiring teachers. And it sounded great to me. I was a mom at the time and it was the most important thing in the world to me. I was like, “I’m going to make money and be able to be a parent.” That was my initial motivation.

Being somebody that has never taken pharmaceuticals, I wasn’t a proponent. I’m a longtime proponent of cannabis since I was 15. I kept it under the radar [then]. It was really important to me to make sure when I got into pharmaceuticals, as well, that I was doing something that aligned with my values.

I was in respiratory sales for almost 13 years.

Doria: Were you selling equipment or drugs?

Franny: I was selling drugs. Through that, I went through sales management training. I had the opportunity to work in a bunch of different divisions in pharmaceuticals. I learned so much about how to run a business. My passion was always in science. I spend six weeks [in] rotations in their manufacturing facilities. [It was] deep in the health and wellness part of it. That’s where I really became disillusioned the more I found out. I was like, “This is the un-healthcare industry. There’s nothing healthy in this place.” What do I do if I’m selling a lifesaving drug, even if I’m [not] helping people? It wasn’t authentic anymore. Once you learn, you can’t unlearn.

Doria: Yeah that is so true. That denial gets broken down.

Franny: Yeah, it becomes a choice. The more I learned, the harder it was to make a choice to stay in that industry.

Doria: It’s so understandable. Many people have loans that they really struggle to pay back, or [they’re] sold on this idea of getting a bachelor’s degree [that it] doesn’t matter what it’s in — you’ll get a job somehow. Oftentimes, [that’s] much more difficult.

You had a child, so you had added pressure. You went for something that you knew could help sustain you and your child to pay off your loans. Makes a lot of sense.

Franny: Absolutely. I truly believe we all do our best. I’ve got a lot of capabilities to do really great at a lot of things. I have a support [system] of a wonderful family, environment, education, ungodly amounts of energy, and curiosity.

I jumped out of planes. I did all sorts of things to make myself so afraid, I’d stop doing stuff.

Doria: How old were you when you jumped out of a plane?

Franny: Between like 21 and 23. I maybe did it like 30 times. I wanted to make sure I could do [it] without having [a] body on my back.

Doria: Oh my god, yeah.

Franny: Nobody wants anybody on your back, especially when you’re [in your] early 20s. I had to do it so many times.

Doria: Oh my goodness.

Franny: I rode a bike from Seattle to California. [I had] just ungodly amounts of energy.

When I studied special ed — that’s what my master’s was in — my [public health] coursework with [the] Smithsonian Institute was all [about] brain search — teaching with the brain and mind. That’s what brought me to Asheville in 1999 — to start that program here at Montreat College.

Doria: Do you consider yourself neurodivergent?

Franny: Now, I think that if I [grew up] in today’s world, I would have been diagnosed with a bunch of things. Back then, it was easy. They put me in an all-girls school. There [were] nuns [that took] care of me, beat me with a ruler, and locked me in closets. That’s kind of how they handled it.

I was athletic. I went to college in Flagstaff, Arizona — right next to the Grand Canyon. I would take an 18-mile jog in and out of the Grand Canyon. Now, I have a son who’s a world-champion triathlete. We’ve got some good genetics!

Buying a Farm

Doria: You spoke about your move to North Carolina. What was the catalyst for you to buy a farm? Tell us about that.

Franny: As a little girl when I was asked, “What are you going to be when you grow up?” I always said a farmer. I love the land. I didn’t grow up farming, My parents divorced when I was young. My mom was a huge corporate businesswoman and my dad was a cattle farmer. I was one of three girls — in the middle — and they were like, “You’re the only one that got all that stuff in you.” I grew up riding horses. That’s what I love.

I think as we grow up, we always take the best of our childhood and we want to keep that and return to that. We want to keep it in our lives and share it with others. I knew I was going to have a farm. 

I had been a serial entrepreneur since I was a teenager. I started babysitting in college. I had my own commune where we were growing cannabis illegally. 

I knew I just needed to be on a farm. In 2008–2009, we had $10 million in real estate development. All that was like smoke in the mirrors of delusion for me. I was like, “Let me get wrapped up in the outside world, the money, the hustle and bustle, and then that went away.” I had to figure out how to reinvent myself. I went out and got a USDA loan. It was a beginning farmer’s loan of eligibility. I was one of six women in the country that got it [with a] maximum 400-page business plan. 

Doria: Oh my goodness.

Franny: Yeah, it was a lot and [it was] part of the eligibility. I couldn’t get it alone, even though I had a farm, a pharmaceutical career, and a six-figure income. I lost a bunch of real estate.

Doria: Do they do this every year? Is this something that other women, who are interested in farming, can do?

Franny: I super encourage people [to do it]. The USDA is always rotating different things that they’re highlighting. At that time, it was women farmers. To meet the eligibility — which is always the hardest part — you had to have farming experience. 

Doria: Interesting.

Franny: When I got to Asheville, I had three months [to start]. I had a sheriff knock on my door and hand me a $300 fine for having chickens. It might as well have been $3,000. I was like, “I’m a teacher. I’m a single mom. I can’t do that.”

When the movement in Asheville helped get city chickens legal, I helped a few farmers markets here, I consulted everything. I [became] super involved in that so I could meet the eligibility criteria. That’s one of the biggest things but [I] absolutely encourage people to farm regeneratively.

Doria: Got it and yes, regeneratively. How much did the USDA give you, if I may ask?

Franny: $350,000. That’s the maximum that they loan [out]. Most of that was the land.

Doria: Oh wow! They just showed up to help?

Franny: They showed up to help. It took us about five months [in total]. We reduced, reused, and recycled everything. I took my garden shed, our woodworking table, and all the cabinets and sanded everything. I mean, seriously, when they say “labor of love” — it was the most dedicated, heartfelt work I’ve ever done.

The press came in 2012 and they said, “What is this?” I said, “This is a regenerative farm.” Nobody knew what that was. The best I could say was “It’s beyond organic sustainability.” I was on top of a bus talking about GMOs [genetically modified organisms] and nobody knew what [those] were at that time.

Doria: Ahead of your time.

Franny: Yes, I always was. I was like, “Please let cannabis not be like that. Let me not be fashion-forward, again.”

In my thesis in business class, I wrote something about a car and how all the control should be on the steering wheel. This was in 1989. I ended up getting to see the creativity, but the reality of it would never come to fruition. That was in an entrepreneur class.

Doria: Are you not surprised, though, that as women we were [being] gaslit? We’re all told our ideas are not good ones.

Franny: Oh, yeah. In [the] cannabis [industry], it’s so predominantly male.

The Idea of the Farmacy

Doria: You initially started your farm [on] how many acres?

Franny: I’ve continued to acquire little bits of farms around it. We’re at about 36 acres right now on four different parcels.

Doria: That’s impressive and what I read was that it was a destination: You’re doing farming and you also described it as a place where people could have weddings, community events, and goat yoga. I’m really intrigued about [goat yoga]. I hope you have a video on that! What [were] your initial visions as you bought the farm and started doing this work?

Franny: One of my dear friends growing up had a younger brother with Down syndrome. My whole life, I’ve really been drawn and connected to youth and animals; those that do not speak. I have a really good way of interacting. It’s always been a dream of mine to have music festivals and animals and have a good time. I was really about farming and having a good time. 

I still worked my pharmaceutical job [while I started]. It took me almost four years before I could quit. It was a big transition but that was the objective. 

Doria: Wow, that’s hard. You were stretched thin for those four years I would imagine.

Franny: Yeah, that’s why they called me “the hippie in high heels.” It became “the hippie in boots.” I’d have a skirt suit on and tall boots every day. 

Growing with Cannabis

Doria: I love it! You mentioned you’ve always been interested in cannabis, but at some point, you were also beginning to see movements in the cannabis and hemp industries. How did that evolve? Was it parallel?

Franny: I never even had it on the radar, sister. It never even crossed my mind. If I were to write 100 things, it wouldn’t have probably crossed my mind as even an option. I made straight As and went to school, got scholarships, and everything. 

Cannabis was always really important for me to be able to write papers and focus. I’d always use it self-medicating in a health-and-wellness focus type of way. 

When I was teaching business of farming and poultry classes, I saw a little bit about “let farmers grow hemp.” I was like, “What is this?” They said, “Well, we’re trying to get it passed in North Carolina but the state won’t do it. We have to find farmers. We need to raise 100,000 signatures, 200,000 for a co-op, and 250,000 in escrow.” I was like, “Well, this is what I do. I connect.” So, I got involved. I was able to help with fundraising and signatures. [It was] still never even in my mind that I was going to plant it in a mountain town. 

Doria: Was this for a ballot initiative? Is that how it works in North Carolina?

Franny: North Carolina was the fifth state to get approved for the Industrial Hemp Program. That was in 2017 — that was the first year that we planted. We went through all this five times. It went through the vote [and] didn’t pass. It took us two years to get all this stuff done. One morning, I got a call from my buddy and he said, “My friend, it passed! We need crops in the ground in three weeks.”

Doria: Oh my gosh, what did that feel like?

Franny: So panicked. He said, “You have to grow.” I said, “I can’t grow. I got too much stuff going on. Where are we going to get the seeds? It’s illegal.” Meanwhile, we’d been working with internationals in Italy. [They are] on the same latitude to the right growing season. We knew we wanted to get seeds from there. We already had the source. Those came over on a ship [with] all sorts of delays. I grew for food and fiber the first year just to let people think I’m cool. So, there, it happened. I didn’t even know I was the first person eight months later [to] put seeds in the ground. 

The first thing I did was get my farm partners in-state. They have two research stations here. I was like, “I need to share these seeds with you so we all grow [them] in these three different areas. We can compare them and help each other.” We harvested, had a festival, and educated everybody. It was a ton of fun. 

I ended up getting an award in the mail [saying], “Congratulations, you’re the first female farmer in North Carolina’s department.” I was like, “Can you validate this?!” They said [they would], and [I was] actually the 11th female farmer in the country. 

Doria: That’s incredible. 

Franny: At the time, growing cannabis was only in research and universities. There was nobody legitimately [growing it] as a farmer in real-life scenarios. I ended up getting it catapulted a lot. 

Catapulting into Fame

Franny: I was a featured farmer for Hemp History Week. I was the first person to do a TED Talk on hemp. 

On the TED Talk, I talked a little bit about the history and the beauty of this plant. There are 450 plants out there and only one has receptors in our body that we were created along with. This plant [and us] go hand in hand. It’s up to us to reclaim that history and learn why.

What Is Hemp?

Doria: For listeners who don’t know, what is hemp typically used for? What are its uses? Then we’ll move on to cannabis.

Franny: Industrial hemp is defined as cannabis. [It] had less than 3 percent THC — we call that the high cannabinoid; that’s what all the dispensaries out West call it. It’s the only one most research can find that has psychoactive effects. Its uses are recreational and pain management. It helps people with their appetite. It is in the medicinal and recreational area. Industrial hemp has been used for food, fiber, building materials, plants, our clothes, textiles, [everything]. They say there’s 50,000 uses for it. 

Doria: Incredible.

Franny: There is a really strong need. It tends to be higher in the CBD area — it’s the second most researched cannabinoid, which has all the anti-inflammatory effects — 

Doria: For arthritis, right?

Franny: Yes, so it has industrial components to it and it has medicinal components. 

Doria: Is it true, then, to say that you pretty much can use all parts of the plant?

Franny: It is but not all parts of the same plant. When you are growing THC, those are only female plants. Female plants are big and bushy. They have these beautiful buds. 

The male plant, which is generally grown for seed and fiber, is the tall one. That’s your 10- and 15-foot plants. [They have] very few buds — the buds are all seedy — so we grow them as trees. 

I did a lot of consulting and farming. People could fly me through a drone or use their phone and I’ll be like, “Male, male, male, [female].”

Doria: That’s incredible. 

The Fran-chise

Doria: In entrepreneurship — in my experience — things rarely fall into place. It’s not like it just happens. To kind of walk through how I understand your story — from the idea of becoming a farmer to an industry expert to producer to wholesaler to national distributor to franchise owner. Is that about how [it] went?

Franny: It’s not linear, but, yes, it did happen really fast. I was the first person to grow, and then the next year we were like, “What are we going to do?” and I said, “I’m going to grow again.” [It] was so intensive and not profitable. It was a passion project. When I went into that second year, we were growing CBD and cannabinoids. 

I partnered with some of my dear friends that are doing the same thing. That’s how we [came to] open the second dispensary. When we opened that, we were able to transition and start manufacturing our own products. Then, we opened the third dispensary. We started a franchise model, which took about a year and a lot of money to get that going. 

Doria: I can imagine.

Franny: Now, we have 11 stores in six states. 

Doria: I know, I was going to get to that but you beat me to it! From each stage — from farmer to industry — can you give me one pro and con? How were you feeling? How was it going? 

Franny: Oh, yes. I can tell you a consistent theme — everything that happens is for me. On the fear side of it, I was like, “Oh my gosh, can I do it? People are looking to me for answers.” I didn’t want to manufacture my own products. I went out and tried to find them, but there was nobody that could do it. I asked questions that [couldn’t] be answered. When I ask questions, these experts also [wanted] to know the answer. It comes back on me. It is a huge responsibility and challenge, which is the beauty of it. 

It’s research and this is why I love research. I’ve done a lot of things that really don’t work out that well. In the industry, we were vertically integrated. There was nobody to do it. I had to set up each one of these things. We were the first people in all of the country to do a public crowdfunding for a cannabis business. 

Doria: How much did you raise?

Franny: We raised $500,000 in 48 hours. 

Doria: Incredible!

Franny: People had never seen something [like that].

Doria: That’s in addition to the $350,000, right? At this point, about $1 million has been put into your business. 

Franny: Yeah, right, which has allowed us to stay small. This was the other thing — never overpromise and under-deliver.