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Full Transcript:

Note: This is an original transcript–edited for sense, length, and clarity.  If you have any questions or concerns, please email our host, Doria Lavagnino, at doria@sheventurespodcast.com.

Intro: 

Doria Lavagnino: Today’s guest believes education is not only a traditional four-year college but vocational and technical schools, as well. She was the first in her family to attend college. She’s earned her J.D. Earlier in her career, she was counsel for several major financial services firms where she managed multi-billion dollars. She became increasingly active in college savings, otherwise known as 529 plans, and pivoted to advocating and educating about college savings full-time. Her book, Route 529: A Parent’s Guide to Saving for College and Career Training with 529 Plans, is a fabulous, actionable, and easy-to-understand guide with key takeaways at the end of each chapter. You’re sure to understand what the salient points are. 

Today, she is COO of Gift of College, for setting up 529 education plans between employers, individuals, families, and friends —  you can gift a 529 plan! As her career has gone on, she’s become increasingly philanthropic and she’s also an activator in what was formerly known as SheEO and is now called Coralus. The goal there is to support women-led ventures. Their goal is to reach one million women activators —  such as our guest today —  and have a $1 billion perpetual fund, which would support 10,000 women-led ventures each year. I love the hashtag that they’ve appropriated: #radicalgenerosity. [It’s] about her journey, pivots, how to prioritize savings, and why radical generosity matters. Patricia Roberts, welcome to SheVentures!

Patricia Roberts: Thank you! I am so happy to be here with you today.

Doria: I am delighted to have you on! I realized when I was going through your intro, I was like, “My goodness, this is so long!” But you have done a lot in your life. Where I wanted to start, when I was looking through your book, I noticed that, and it was touching to me, you dedicated it to your mother. She was a single head of household raising five people, including herself, as well. What lessons did you learn from her?

Lessons from Mom

Patricia: Wow, thank you for mentioning my mom. She is near and dear to my heart, and boy, do I miss her. She passed away in 2016. What lessons did I learn from her? First of all, I want to mention she became a single head of household quite suddenly when my father suddenly disappeared. I was 10 years old. This was not something that she had planned on. It happened quite suddenly.

Doria: He just disappeared?

Patricia: He disappeared. What she didn’t know as a homemaker (at his insistence) and as somebody in the 1970s —  not unlike most other women, without money or credit in her name —  was that our home was about to go into foreclosure and our cars were about to be repossessed. So, what did I learn from that experience and her? A lot. 

One thing that she taught all of us was, regardless of the relationships that we pursue in our adult life, to always have a vision of the finances of whatever the situation is and money in our own name that would always keep us safe and empower us. That’s something that I definitely learned from her. 

Another thing that I learned from my mom is the value of faith. She had an unshakable faith in God but also coupled that with action. She taught us the power of faith plus action and that stays with me to this day. Oh my God, that’s unstoppable. 

I also learned about the importance of self-care. She really didn’t have the opportunity, once those circumstances changed, to take very good care of herself. In fact, she was selfless in many ways. I’m sure I developed some of those tendencies myself as so many women do. It affected her health —  the stress of everything she had gone through and not taking time for herself. 

There were four of us. And I was the youngest. My oldest sibling has a developmental disability. Then, two in between. We were a lot to manage. I really did learn from her modeling of not taking very good care of herself, even for a few minutes a day. I learned the importance of that and I’m trying to do better myself. 

Doria: Right, it’s the idea that self-care is not selfish. I think we all internalize that to some degree. Yet, to your point, if we don’t take care of ourselves, nothing else in our life works. There are situations, like the one with your mother, [that] it must have been incredibly difficult, especially with the sudden change. I think I saw you tearing up there for a moment. [I can] imagine how much you admire her and how much she gave to you. I just want to honor her. 

Patricia: Thank you. She really encouraged each of us. 

Doria: Of course. 

Patricia: She cheered my brother on through the Special Olympics. Each of us, no matter what we were interested in, she was 100 percent with us. I appreciate that. I know how proud she was of each of us and how proud we were and are of her. It just means so very much to me.

Doria: Yes, and this is a hard transition to make, so I’m gonna try to do it as delicately as possible. It kind of now makes even more sense to me why you were interested in financial services. One of the other points in your book is that you and your husband were both first-generation college students. When you started your education journey, did you know about saving for college?

Her Education Journey

Patricia: I almost didn’t start my education journey. I want to make this point because it’ll help you to understand why I appreciate higher education so much. My high school guidance counselor suggested I not go to college because of the fragile state of my family. My mother became very ill and there were a lot of other complexities; she had a stroke, and she was in intensive care on and off for many years. Things were very fragile. I had stepped into —  even as the youngest child, for whatever reason —  a leadership role in my family and was kind of keeping everything together. My high school guidance counselor thought I should stick with the waitressing job that I had because I was doing well with it. I was working from 5 a.m. to 2 p.m. on Saturdays and Sundays at a local diner and then some weeknights. Had I followed that suggestion, I think my life would have been entirely different. 

Here I am, the high school newspaper editor —  I turned out to be our commencement speaker —  [getting the] suggestion that I not go to college. My mom would have nothing of it. She absolutely insisted, regardless of the financial situation [and] everything else going on, that I go. We would figure it out and we did. 

I had no financial preparation for that experience but I went. Unlike most students at my university who were getting checks in the mail, I was sending checks home to my mother to help keep them afloat. I worked several jobs, but I made it work. In terms of financial preparation, there was none. I probably under-applied to colleges because I really didn’t know how capable I was or what schools would pursue me, necessarily. 

I did stay in the state of Pennsylvania. I had wanted to go to the Syracuse Newhouse School of Communication, but New York did not have reciprocity with the state aid that I was eligible for in Pennsylvania so I stayed in-state. I did the best I could with the information I had, but no financial preparation whatsoever and no financial preparation for law school that I eventually pursued. I did that at night while working full time. 

I tried to defray costs by pursuing [law school], but I still —  together with my husband —  wound up with over $100,000 in student loan debt. I think I mentioned in the book [but] that was part of our reason for being absolutely determined to do better for our child. We knew the financial stress that we were under for 20 years, paying that money back. We did pay it back. My loans were completely resolved. I paid them off.

Doria: Yeah, that’s an amazing feeling!

Patricia: Oh my God, I never got my diplomas framed, but I did have a strong desire to frame that letter! It meant so much to me. I think this whole experience of almost not going to college, then incurring that debt, and the many doors that those degrees have opened for me —  I could have never lifted myself out of that situation without higher education. I am a huge advocate. 

Years later, one of the proudest things [I’ve done] was, [I bought] a home for both my mom and brother to live in. The fact that I could do that —  I don’t think I could have accomplished that in my professional life had I stuck with the waitressing job. 

Doria: Oh, I want to point out, because I hear this a lot with some of our guests, is what the outside thinks is right for us. The fact that you were young, impressionable, and this high school guidance counselor’s telling you, “No, I think you should stay at home.” On one hand, from a pragmatic perspective, where [they are] coming from … but thank goodness you had the wherewithal to say, “No, I have to do this now. Whatever it’s gonna be, it’s gonna be.” To your point, if you’re not prepared, there is a huge debt that follows. 

Getting into Financial Services

Doria: Painting your early career in very broad strokes, you worked your way up to a managing director of a large financial services firm. What drew you to established firms early in your career? Why did you specialize in financial services?

Patricia: What drew me to large firms early in my career? I think the need to work. I mean, in the 1980s, I don’t know if you’ll recall, there were newspapers with “help wanted” sections; in the 70s they were listed by women and men, but regardless. I showed up in New York City in the 1980s with my newly minted philosophy science degree and I found a job. I lived in the rectory of an Episcopal church in Manhattan. I rented a room and shared a bathroom sometimes with visiting monks [or] others. I had my $50-a-week room and I looked for a job. 

The first job I found happened to be in financial services. There was no intention behind any of this. It interested me certainly due to the financial backstory that I had and my wanting to be more secure and have a better understanding of financial matters. That certainly played into it. I started with a small firm initially and then proceeded to Smith Barney. 

I went to law school at night while working at Smith Barney. I told no one that I was going to law school at night. I inquired to see if it would be eligible for tuition reimbursement. It wasn’t part of my legal work [and] wasn’t part of my current job. It would not likely lead to a degree so that nobody would reimburse it. I thought, “I’m just going to stay quiet about this.” I did it for four years at night. I got this degree and then I ended up getting introduced to the general counsel of the parent company who was Chuck Prince, of Travelers group. 

Most first-year attorneys are not going straight in-house. They’re working at law firms for years, getting that experience, and then going in-house. I had the opportunity to just be there. 

Doria: That’s great.

Patricia: And for 529 to fall into my lap, all the better. I loved getting that assignment. I was asked, I think it was 1998 —  I was newly pregnant with my son —  if I would take time to learn about section 529 of the Internal Revenue Code. Citigroup wanted to get into that business as an asset manager or an investment manager. These funds needed to be professionally managed by a firm and my firm was interested. I learned about 529. I probably was one of the earlier people to do so. I helped Citi get involved in a couple of state programs. My firm got involved in the management of funds. I eventually moved to the business side at Merrill Lynch and worked on the same exact products. I’ve been working on these products for 25 years now. It’s incredible.

Doria: It’s incredible to have that whole experience. It’s like a 360 of what goes on with 529, right?

Patricia: Right, and to have used the plan, too. I’m sure we’ll talk about [it] now.

A Male-Dominated Money Industry

Doria: Exactly, yes! Financial services are still pretty male-dominated, although it’s improving. What was it like to be a woman in a male-dominated industry?

Patricia: I don’t know, I mean I certainly felt grateful to be there [and] have the opportunity to learn from men. I can’t say that I recall a whole lot of equity, necessarily, but I always try to work hard and get recognized in my own way. I recall instances of being asked if I was married, is my husband successful, and things like that in the workplace that come up and seem a little bit odd. I don’t know who would possibly ask that, but [they] certainly did. It was okay. I do remember, quite honestly, some women not being particularly supportive of other women. 

Doria: Right, I’ve heard that before.

Patricia: Yeah, I remember some of that. It’s sort of disheartening that we were talking about equity and equality so many years ago. Although there’s been some progress, it doesn’t feel like there’s been enough. We go all the way back that long ago [and] there were conversations around this and improvements that needed to be made. I have seen improvements through the years [that have] made it more comfortable for both men and women to work together and feel more at ease in the workplace. I think there are miles to go before we sleep.

Doria: I think that that is probably true. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t feel that the diversity piece of it was as much considered in the 90s as it is today.

Patricia: I think that’s true. I think in financial services and even in the legal profession to some extent, at least at that time, I don’t know that there was necessarily a broad pipeline of people that might even be interested in these types of jobs. I think that a much better job is being done. 

I happen to be involved with the Council of Urban Professionals. I was a 2012 Fellow. They’re on a mission to help both women and persons of color advance in the workplace, make connections, and develop in organizations that elevate. I was just at an event last night where the focus was on diversity, equity, and inclusion. “Belonging” goes with the DEI. I hear there’s a B now which makes sense.

Doria: The acronyms are gonna get so long at some point.

Patricia: There’s an A for accessibility, that disability side of it, too.

Doria: Makes sense.

Patricia: Those were not being focused on as much back at that time. We have made progress. There’s more to go.

Climbing the Corporate Ladder

Doria: Yes, I agree. Your resume shows that you were able to climb the corporate ladder. I know you were hungry, very talented, and ambitious. Are there tips that you want to share with women today as to how to help them achieve career success in corporate America?

Patricia: Sure! One tip I would have is to think about what is unique about you and where your value lies. I think we often don’t reflect on ourselves. We’re not taught to take a careful look at ourselves. We’re oftentimes outwardly focused. I’d spend a good amount of time thinking about yourself, your gifts, what interests you, what lights you up, what you feel that you’re great at, what you like, or what things you’d like to learn about. Focus on those aspects as you’re beginning to search for something. 

Then, when you find something, really pay attention to how comfortable you are in the setting. Take a look at the people who have progressed further. To that extent, get a sense of what kind of life you want to live. If it’s in the legal profession and you’re looking at women who have made partner, what’s the quality of their life like? If you can get to know these people or observe from the outside, see if that’s a life that you would even want as you’re thinking of what you’re aspiring to. I think that’s important. 

Whatever you do along the way, within it find people that you can really get to know well and develop relationships with. I’m an introvert, so sometimes it’s hard for me. I do make the effort, but sometimes it’s hard to get to know people. There are people who are very much worth knowing and can help you. They talk about having a personal “board of directors.” It doesn’t have to be that formal, but people you can talk to in a really honest and candid way.

[It’s also] the importance of finding a sponsor. It doesn’t have to be somebody formally, but somebody who will mention your name in a positive way or think of you when you’re not in the room when promotional considerations are underway.

Doria: Yes, I love that.

Patricia: Get to know people. If you’re just sitting at your desk, which I would do from time to time, and working hard, keeping [your] head down, you’re not marking those [connections]. Get out there a little bit, interact with others, [and] talk with others. There’s nothing wrong with a bit of self-promotion. 

I think [as] women, we often think we can’t talk about ourselves [or] mention our achievements. Keep track of your achievements. Note them when appropriate. First of all, they make you feel great. [Keep] a “badass list of things that I’ve accomplished,” big and small through the years. Taking a look back at that can make a huge difference. [It] can give you the dose of energy that you need; the confidence that you need to pursue something that seems like it’s going to be a little bit hard. Track your progress, be grateful along the way, get to know people, and get to know yourself. I assure you, it does all work out. 

When I look back, I can connect the dots to how I got to where I’m at. I wish that for many others. I think it often is [not] the case. You can’t see it at the time, when you’re in it, right? 

Doria: Absolutely. It’s times like those you feel lost. It’s like “Where’s my compass?” It always ends up working out the way that it’s meant to.

Making Savings Personal

Doria: In your book, your son wrote a note. He mentions that you and your husband did not want to incur debt. Is this when you decided, personally, to focus [on it]? I know that you were doing it professionally, but I guess this was your first experience as a consumer of a 529 plan. How was that for you?

Patricia: Yeah, I mean, I always encourage people to start with their why. If they’re thinking of any long-term goal or any objective, why are you doing it? Why were we doing it? We were absolutely intent on this child having a less financially stressful academic experience than we had. We knew what it felt like to not be prepared and we wanted to do better for him. Married just a couple of years, we were living in a one-bedroom apartment. We knew we’d need a babysitter and would have all sorts of additional expenses. We had no idea how we were going to save for this child, but we said we were gonna find a way. We were gonna find a way and we did. We took a little bit out of each paycheck. I got an account open. I’m grateful that I had the knowledge of 529 plans. Believe it or not, these plans have been around [for years] and a percent of Americans can’t identify what they are and even those who do know what they are, don’t know how they work. They don’t really understand them.

Doria: Absolutely.

Patricia: Oh my god. I was grateful I had the knowledge. I decided, together with my husband, that we were gonna both send money from our paycheck directly into this account. If we didn’t see the money, if it didn’t pass through our hands, we thought we’d have a better chance. Then, as we evolved in our career or we had found money —  maybe a tax return, a bonus, or something —  we started to put a bit more in. I gotta tell you, setting that up gave me just an immediate sense of relief that I was doing something to address the concern I had.  

I know it’s hard for people to get started, particularly in those early days of parenthood; your eyes are blurry about it or anywhere else along the way. It just seems like this insurmountable goal. “How am I gonna pay for this thing called higher education?” I’ll tell everyone: Getting started feels good. It’s the most important step. Once you get started, you can then begin to save. You can invite others to join you on your journey. I talk about that in the book. 

Doria: What I love about what you’re saying is you’re leading through example. One of my questions was going to be and what I hear often is, “I can’t save for X, Y, or Z (in this case a 529 plan) because I have a mortgage. I have to pay my nanny. I have to take care of my mother.” We didn’t have as much in the beginning, but as we continued to work, we just did what we could and increased it. There’s so much to be said for that. I really appreciate that. 

Gift of College

Doria: Today, you’re COO of Gift of College. I was hoping you could tell our audience, how does the company help with 529 plans? Give a definition of both 529 and the 529A (ABLE) plans. I did not know that there was something called the 529 ABLE plan. Take it away. 

Patricia: Okay, so let’s see, a quick definition of 529 plans. These are named after section 529 of the Internal Revenue Code, which helped to create them. These are special accounts that allow U.S. residents and taxpayers to save for a particular purpose. What it means is when you contribute funds or deposit funds into a 529 plan and they grow in value, the earnings on these plans are not taxed as they grow —  unlike if you have a bank savings account or other forms of investments, you’re probably getting a tax statement at your end that shows you owe tax on the earnings. 529 plans are growing tax-deferred; you’re not paying tax. When you withdraw the funds and use them for a wide range of educational expenses, those earnings are never taxed. Less tax can mean more money for higher education. 

I do want to stress [that] these plans are not just for college. Many people, because they’re called college savings plans, assume they’re for a traditional four-year college. You can use them for two-year, four-year, trade and technical school, [and] graduate apprenticeships. They have been made broader in terms of their use these days.

Doria: I recently learned that if you set up the 529 plan if for whatever reason, something happens to your beneficiary or you don’t want to give it to them you can then take it and use it yourself, right?

Patricia: Exactly, right. There is a tremendous amount of flexibility built into 529 college savings plans. Not only can they be used for a wide range of educational experiences from trade and technical school to registered apprenticeships to two-year, four-year college graduate and professional studies, these plans, if they are not needed in part or in full for the future student for whom you were saving, but the funds are always yours as the account owner. Nothing is lost. 

There’s some myth around something’s going to be lost if the original child doesn’t go. No, the funds belong to you. A member of the family can use the funds of the original beneficiary. That could be a parent; you could be the parent and use it for yourself. You could use it for another sibling of that child who didn’t need it; you could use it for a cousin, an aunt, or uncle. It’s a very broad range of people that can use it. If the student didn’t need the money because they got a scholarship, you can withdraw the funds. There’s never a penalty associated with any of this. You just need to pay the tax on the earnings that you didn’t pay as the account owner. As the account owner, you always have access to the funds. You can switch it to another person, you can use it for yourself, or you can save it for your child’s children someday. 

If you’ve got a little bit left over, there’s no time limit. There’s not so much to worry about in terms of, what if the child doesn’t need it. Starting in 2024, details don’t need to be worked out. 

Doria: That’s interesting. Is there an amount or limitation on the amount that you can put into the 529?

Patricia: This varies by state, but most of the 529 plans have a maximum contribution or balance limit. Some base it on how much you put in, others base it on how much it grows to, but it’s often in the hundreds of thousands of dollars. Some of the plans go all the way up to over $500,000. Some of them are $300,000 or $400,000. You can put a large amount in the 529 plan. On the other end of it, you can put a small amount in. 

One of the myths is it takes a lot of money to get started or you have to contribute a lot. Not true. Many of the state plans allow you to get started for under $25. I think in New York, you can get started with as little as $1 or $5. Getting started is what matters most.

Doria: Absolutely, exactly. To your point, I think when I created my 529 plans for my children, it was different. There was a lot of paperwork. It was a little bit more involved. Now, you can go online and do it in like 10 minutes. How does it work on your platform?

Patricia: That’s right. Gift of College has a first-of-its-kind gift card that can be given to anyone as a contribution to their 529 accounts. This is plan agnostic. It can go into any account. I could know nothing about whether you do or don’t have an account for your daughters or whether you’re in a particular plan, but for one of their birthdays or perhaps as a baby shower gift for you or someone else, I could give a gift card, $25 to $200. You, as the recipient, through Gift of College could redeem it into your plan of choice. 

Doria: That’s cool.

Patricia: We have these gift cards. They are sold at CVS across the U.S. and online. I give these gifts all the time. People are getting a lot of traditional gifts —  which are needed but some of them, not so much. Not so sure about the Diaper Genie and some of this other stuff and nothing against that but the more traditional gifts —  the $60 little outfits that they’re going to grow out of in two days. I show up with a gift card for a college savings account. People are like, “Whoa! What’s that?”

Doria: I love it.

Patricia: Now that I’ve written my book, that can be coupled with a gift card and can be given for any occasion, for a child of any age. That’s foundational for Gift of College. It’s something we have and we sell them online, as well. A lot of employers are giving these to parents who have expanded the size of their family, instead of a silver spoon or something more traditional. 

Doria: I got a silver spoon from Tiffany & Co. I [was] like, “What am I supposed to do with this?”

Patricia: Lovely. Yeah, one of my clients at Gift of College is giving a $1,000 gift card and my book to any employee who expanded the size of their family. I think that’s a meaningful gift. That’s a gift of financial wellness.

Doria: Lovely.

Patricia: We’ve got the gift cards. Then, we have a platform that employers can use to educate their employees about 529 college savings plans and equivalents that can be used for disability-related expenses. These are accounts that were created for individuals to use to save for a disabled person’s future, whatever that future may be. The funds in a 529 ABLE account can be used for education —  if they’re needed for that purpose —  transportation, housing, or anything that supports the health and well-being of a disabled individual. I love those accounts. 

Our platform educates, from a financial wellness perspective, employees about the existence and usefulness of 529 college savings and ABLE accounts. Then, our platform also allows employers to offer payroll deductions, exactly what I did when I was a new mom with my son. 

Doria: Yep, you don’t see it. You don’t spend it.

Patricia: What’s interesting about our platform is it works for any plan. Employers in multiple states with employees in multiple states don’t know which plan to offer their employees. What’s great about our platform is its open architecture. The benefits team doesn’t have to pick the New York plan over the New Jersey plan over the Connecticut plan. The employee selects for themselves. Our platform also works for student loan repayment assistance. The employer can match contributions to 529 college savings, match to ABLE accounts, or contribute to an employee’s student loan.

Doria: That’s incredible.

Patricia: That is what Gift of College offers in the workplace. This is exactly how I pay for my own child and I can speak from the heart. Now, I don’t need to pay for my child anymore; he’s already gotten his graduate degree. I’m saving for my brother’s future in an ABLE account through work and my employer. Gift of College matches $1,000 into my brother’s ABLE account each year and I appreciate that. 

Doria: That’s cool.

Patricia: When I talk to employers, I can say: This is what I save for my son, this is the way I’m saving for my brother, and this is how my employer is helping me, and it means a lot. It does mean a lot.

Doria: To reflect back on what I think I’ve understood, just like a 401(k), where employers match a certain amount, you enable an option for employers to match a certain amount in a 529 or a 529 ABLE plan, is that right?

Patricia: Yes, that is right. Employers can match what employees are contributing themselves, or they can do a one-time contribution. Employers design it however they want. We have employers who are doing everything from $100 when an employee opens an account, just as an incentive to get them to do it and that’s it. Then, we have employers who are matching $100 a month. We have employers who are giving a 529 contribution when a baby is born or adopted into a family, which I think is great as well, or a combination of all of it. It’s all good. I love it.

529 vs ABLE Plans

Doria: All of it. I love it. I did have a question about the ABLE plan. I know it’s for disabled people. Does that also include neurodivergent students? That’s become increasingly common. If you have ADD or executive processing issues, do they have to be physical disabilities?

Patricia: Next, I will explain the criteria for ABLE, but I do want to mention first that the 529 college savings plan can be used to pay for special needs services for beneficiaries. I just want you to know that with respect to 529 because I didn’t mention that. With the ABLE plan, the requirement there is that the disability needs to be significant. The individual needs to meet certain criteria that would make them eligible for SSI (Supplemental Security Income) or, I believe, SSDI (Social Security Disability Insurance). They need a medical certification saying they meet these types of requirements. It’s gotta be a pretty significant disability, and it needs to have developed before the age of 26. That’s how that legislation was able to get passed through eventually, which is great. 

The legislation was passed in that regard because that will help veterans and others who may have developed a disability later in life or people who have been in an accident or something like that. The current rules are under 26 and significant disability. I guess it would depend on the type of neurodivergent situation and how significant.

Doria: Okay, I asked because I know that that’s a very common criterion or condition that I have come across recently. I was curious how that would fit in. [It] doesn’t really matter in the sense that if you want to do a 529, there are no additional benefits to doing a 529 ABLE plan, correct? They’re both the same.

Patricia: They’re similar in scope. What you can contribute to an ABLE plan is somewhat less overall. There are some limitations. Once you hit $100,000 in the ABLE account, it could potentially impact Medicaid and reduce your benefits in that regard. What’s great about ABLE, and I didn’t mention it, is for the first time they are allowing persons with disabilities who receive these benefits like SSI and Medicaid to save money in their own name. 

Up until ABLE came about six or eight years ago, individuals like my brother could never have more than $2,000 in their name because it would impact their benefits. If you’re disabled and you’ve gotten these benefits that are your existence, you don’t want to jeopardize them. For years, my brother was keeping money in a small cardboard box rather than in the bank because he couldn’t have money in the bank. This is the theme across the U.S. with people with all sorts of disabilities. Now, with ABLE accounts, they can have money in their own name. My brother has his first debit card. He feels what he can do with his own money and he doesn’t have to worry that his medical assistance is going to be impacted. They can save up to $100,000, I think, and not have an impact on SSI, which is a significant amount. With the 529s, I was mentioning, it could be up to $500,000 and such, so there are some differences.

Vetting 529 Plans

Doria: How does the platform vet 529 plans? Is there a criteria? I’m just thinking about how Morningstar vets mutual funds. Is there a similar way in which 529 plans are vetted?

Patricia: Morningstar, by the way, also vets 529 plans, as does a website called savingforcollege.com. They give five cap mortarboard ratings to 529 plans in different categories. That’s worth taking a look at. We don’t vet the 529 plans. We make all plans available through our platform. We have a really objective search tool. We’re rating plans. We use a firm called Invite Education. They do terrific research about getting all the facts straight on the 529 plans. We have it on our site for people to choose for themselves. 

We’re not giving investment advice. We’re not vetting the plans. We’re making certain that all plans are available and trusting that people are doing their own research in that regard. We do have a financial representative available at no cost if somebody wants to ask an opinion, or get some advice and guidance. We offer access to all plans. We think that is what’s most important. 

Misconceptions of 529 Plans

Doria: Yes, that is wonderful. I’m so excited just thinking about it. What do you think is the most common misconception that you hear about 529 or college saving plans, assuming people even know what they are?

Patricia: One of the biggest misconceptions about 529 plans is that they’re just for college. People don’t understand that they can be used for a much wider range of post-secondary education expenses. They can also, now, be used for K-12 tuition. That’s something that people definitely don’t know. 

I think the other misconception is that the beneficiary is the child of the account owner, but that’s not the case. Many, many grandparents open accounts for a grandchild who they love. Aunts and uncles can do it, friends and others can do the same. It doesn’t have to be a parent. 

People also think they need to invest in their home state plan. While it’s a great idea and probably appropriate to check your home state plan that is unique based on your residency, you don’t have to invest in your home state plan. You can put a certain amount in your home state plan, and if you like another plan —  you’ve read about them, you’ve seen a rating of some sort, and you’re wondering, “Could I be in another plan?” Yes, you can be in another plan as well. No need to feel you have to be constrained by a particular state plan or have to go to college in a particular state to use the plan. That’s also not true. 529 college savings plans can be used broadly across the U.S. and across the world in many instances. No constraints there, as well. 

Doria: I didn’t know that.

Patricia: I’m trying to think of any other misconceptions. I think those are the biggest ones. Along the lines of somehow you’re going to lose the money, there are many ways you can use that money and you will never lose it as the account owner. I think also what people don’t understand, which I think is important to understand, is that the account owner is always in control of the account. Unlike a UGMA (Uniform Gifts to Minors Account) or UTMA (Uniform Transfers to Minors Act), where the child has access to the money — it’s theirs when they’re 18 or 21, depending on state law — for 529 that’s not the case. If your child’s going in a direction that you’re [against], that money is not theirs. They can’t get access to it. You’ve got control, should you ever need it for yourself. We know in the current marketplace, people’s desires change. You might want to use some of that money for yourself for retooling your career or to pursue something out of desire. You can do that. The money is yours. I think that’s important and people don’t understand. 

Entrepreneurship Skills of Advice

Doria: These are all great points. Wrapping up, I wanted to ask —  of course, I’m gonna ask where listeners can find out more about you, your book, and Gift of College —  but before that, what are three skills from your years in corporate jobs that help you acclimate to more of an entrepreneurial role [and] where you are today.

Patricia: Three skills from the bigger firms that helped me in my smaller firm today? One is setting critical objectives; making sure that I understand with certainty what are the most critical few objectives that I need to be pursuing and keep that in mind. That is one skill.  

Another skill is, I would say time management. I am pretty good at blocking out time, staying extremely focused on what needs to be accomplished, and not checking emails every few minutes or getting distracted with phone calls and other things. I try to be truly present with what I am working on as well. Multitasking, I’ve learned, doesn’t always work. 

Then the other skill I would say I learned in larger organizations is the power of collaboration. We cannot do it alone. We all bring different skills and perspectives to whatever we’re working on early —  if they happen to be an ultimate decision maker on it, getting buy-in early on can be extremely helpful. Those are three among the many, many things I learned while working in larger [corporate] settings

Doria: Yes, that’s really helpful. I ask you this question because you’re a COO, and you’re involved in a lot of the processes and the hierarchy of decision-making. I’ve spoken to many entrepreneurs and new entrepreneurs who are very distracted by what’s termed “shiny object syndrome.” That can be debilitating not only to the business but to yourself. I admire your ability to do that. 

Where to Find Patricia and Gift of College 

Doria: Where can listeners learn more about you and Gift of College?

Patricia: I am probably most active on LinkedIn. My book, Route 529, Appearance Guide to Saving for College, is available on Amazon and at other booksellers as well.

Doria: Patricia, thank you so much for coming on SheVentures today. It’s been inspirational!

Patricia: I have loved the experience. Thank you for having me!